Föderation EN Fr 17.05.2024 17:06:10 Got an email today from a very smart computer science professor who is totally flummoxed by the #Mastodon signup flow. He tried to follow it based on what Mastodon tells him (the standard verbiage) at my site after reading one of my posts via a URL, and despite creating several accounts at other sites doesn't understand how to use any of it. This is a smart guy. The onboarding and basic explanations situation is still a mess. |
Föderation EN Fr 17.05.2024 17:08:04 |
Föderation EN Fr 17.05.2024 17:09:30 @energisch_ @askfedi That's not a scalable solution. He was asking me, and I don't have the time or expertise to provide him with a tutorial. This is basic stuff the community should provide. |
Föderation EN Fr 17.05.2024 17:10:52 |
Föderation EN Fr 17.05.2024 17:12:18 @energisch_ @lauren @askfedi @FediTips Or using their web site: fedi.tips |
Föderation EN Fr 17.05.2024 17:21:25 @ParadeGrotesque @energisch_ @lauren "This is basic stuff the community should provide." I have a website full of beginner's guides for Mastodon and the Fediverse: โก๏ธ https://fedi.tips If there's something the professor doesn't understand in the guide, ask me directly and will be happy to help directly. I will reword the guide if needed, as it is supposed to be as easy to understand as possible. |
Föderation EN Fr 17.05.2024 17:23:23 @ParadeGrotesque @energisch_ @lauren p.s. On the actual topic, there's a guide to signing up here: https://fedi.tips/which-server-should-i-join-how-do-i-find-out-more-about-a-server/ The sign-up flow is similar to joining any federated network such as email or the conventional telephone network: you sign up on a single provider, and that provider connects you to the other providers seamlessly. |
Föderation EN Fr 17.05.2024 17:28:18 @FediTips @ParadeGrotesque @energisch_ That's really just an FAQ. Not a substitute for a comprehensive getting started guide and explainer about the network. |
Föderation EN Fr 17.05.2024 17:30:04 @lauren @ParadeGrotesque @energisch_ It's not just a FAQ, it's a step by step guide to everything on here. There are hundreds of pages of info on the site. |
Föderation EN Fr 17.05.2024 17:30:58 @FediTips @ParadeGrotesque @energisch_ Why isn't that site directly promoted as the place to go, rather than all the confusing text about logging into this site and other vague statements. It should be big and bold and clearly indicated where users who don't understand any of this after following a URL to a post will know what to do next! |
Föderation EN Fr 17.05.2024 17:34:13 @lauren @ParadeGrotesque @energisch_ I don't work for Mastodon, I am just an unofficial volunteer running an independent site. It's up to the websites of Mastodon etc to decide if they want to link to independent sites. By the way, there are also other guides you can try too: https://fedi.tips/what-do-i-do-next-are-there-any-other-guides-to-mastodon-and-the-fediverse/ |
Föderation EN Fr 17.05.2024 17:37:45 @FediTips @ParadeGrotesque @energisch_ More guides is more confusion. Users "stumbling" onto Mastodon for the first time via an external URL need to know clearly and succinctly what to do next, based on zero knowledge of noncentralized platforms. |
Föderation EN Fr 17.05.2024 17:45:16 @lauren @ParadeGrotesque @energisch_ I do try to assume zero knowledge in my guide, but it's inherent in a federated network that there is never a single point of entry, or single way to sign up. It's similar to email, there is no single guide to email but many different guides that cover how to use it in slightly different ways. Some of the guides are really, really simple short videos that serve as a good quick intro: |
Föderation EN Fr 17.05.2024 17:49:03 |
Föderation EN Fr 17.05.2024 17:45:30 @energisch_ @ParadeGrotesque @FediTips @lauren My assumption is that people choosing my instance share at least some of my sensibilities โ what appeals to me may also appeal to them. But YMMV. So maybe I give alternatives, too. |
Föderation EN Fr 17.05.2024 17:48:04 @Hippasus500 @energisch_ @ParadeGrotesque @FediTips ProTip: Most people used to centralized social media platforms only -- and that 99.999% I'd wager -- don't care a bit about the focus of individual servers. They just want to get online and start communicating. The whole concept of "sharing my sensibilities to choose my server" is completely meaningless to most people. This is why Mastodon fails. |
Föderation EN Fr 17.05.2024 17:49:07 @lauren Mastodon doesn't fail if you look at the sign up numbers @Hippasus500 @ParadeGrotesque @FediTips |
Föderation EN Fr 17.05.2024 17:49:32 @energisch_ @Hippasus500 @ParadeGrotesque @FediTips Drop in the bucket. |
Föderation EN Fr 17.05.2024 18:01:51 @energisch_ @lauren @Hippasus500 @ParadeGrotesque @FediTips you look at many of theose on Mastodon and they are fairly techie. It won't attract the regular person on the street. |
Föderation EN Fr 17.05.2024 18:03:54 @MichaelBishop @energisch_ @Hippasus500 @ParadeGrotesque @FediTips And yet I've dealt with innumerable highly technical people who have wanted to get on Mastodon and found the flow confusing. Often they managed to create an account somewhere and then ... NOW WHAT? And yeah, there are helpful people around, if you can find them, and others that just blow people off with the "if you can't figure it out you don't DESERVE to be here" crap. That's the reality. Still. |
Föderation EN Fr 17.05.2024 18:08:27 @lauren @MichaelBishop @energisch_ @Hippasus500 @ParadeGrotesque The main stumbling block is possibly that people are only used to centralised social media where there's one website, one app, one way of doing things. But if you asked them to sign up for email or phone networks etc, they would have no trouble navigating the much wider range of providers and options. Non-techy people are definitely capable of using this place, it just takes a bit of time to get used to it being different. |
Föderation EN Fr 17.05.2024 18:24:21 @FediTips @lauren @MichaelBishop @energisch_ @Hippasus500 @ParadeGrotesque Lauren & Fedi are saying what matches my experience. Mastodon needs widely accessible community support. I'm grateful for FediTips and various docs I stumbled across. But it was sheer luck at the beginning, logging in when tips crossed my feed. I taught campus tech to first-year students for over a decade, when Prensky's "digital native" metaphor was newโand wrong. Newbies, even able CS folks, need basic intros. |
Föderation EN Fr 17.05.2024 18:08:42 Yeah, well, they get the neo-nazis and the maga cultists, we get the tech bros and the compulsive explainers or mansplainers. Potato, potatoes, etc. |
Föderation EN Fr 17.05.2024 18:18:33 @lauren @ParadeGrotesque @MichaelBishop @energisch_ @FediTips Oh, Iโd say that amongst the millions (estimates varyโฆ) of denizens of the Fediverse, youโll find stripes of anything you can imagine. Letโs say there are 15M people with Fediverse accounts. Statistically, 37,000+ of them score over 140 on a standard IQ test. |
Föderation EN Fr 17.05.2024 22:08:59 @lauren @FediTips @ParadeGrotesque @energisch_ Because Mastodon gGmbH wants to do it their own way. |
Föderation EN Fr 17.05.2024 22:12:51 What @bhawthorne said ... |
Föderation EN Sa 18.05.2024 00:07:00 @ParadeGrotesque @bhawthorne @lauren @energisch_ The structure of this place is that we don't have to use Mastodon if we don't want to. Mastodon servers talk to other types of server too, and even if you stick to a Mastodon server there is a wide range of third party apps which tend to be better than the official apps. I know choice can be quite overwhelming at first, but once you get used to it you appreciate having alternatives in case something is wrong with your current app or server. |
Föderation EN Sa 18.05.2024 06:44:21 @ParadeGrotesque @bhawthorne @lauren @FediTips I see the fediverse as a big crowd of villages, communities, mobile settlements, cities and mega cities. And all have their own charm. Some use Mastodon, some Friendica, some Firefish, some Peertube, some Pixelfeed to do their managing. Those using Mastodon are the biggest crrowd, they got the most villagers & villages. But even those village govs have their own way to do things. Usually the founder of the village also states the rules. 1/2 |
Föderation EN Sa 18.05.2024 06:50:34 @ParadeGrotesque @bhawthorne @lauren @FediTips |
Föderation EN Sa 18.05.2024 14:26:35 @energisch_ @ParadeGrotesque @lauren @FediTips I completely agree. My problem is that one of those villages has grown into a small state, Mastodonia, and the founder created a non-profit to run the state, including the capital city, also called Mastodonia. While other cities in the state are working together to create support networks to welcome in new immigrants and help them understand their new home, most immigrants arrive through the capital city, which is using information for new arrivals that seems to assume immigrants are all part of the construction crew that built Mastodonia when it was new. |
Föderation EN Sa 18.05.2024 14:55:12 If someone could hard fork Mastodon, that would allow current Mastodon servers to easily switch to non-Mastodon software. A hard fork, if there were people available to maintain it, would be the easiest way to make software more diverse on the Fediverse. |
Föderation EN Fr 17.05.2024 17:39:16 @lauren I know @renchap has mentioned they are working on the onboarding experience. Unsure how far out it is. https://joinmastodon.org/roadmap |
Föderation EN Fr 17.05.2024 17:40:17 |